BIP Idea: Scrambling BIP39 recovery seeds
2 messages, 28 to 31 Mar 2026. Started by dr.oso.phila.cgeyb.
dr.oso.phila.cgeyb, Jameson Lopp
Dear Developers
Thank you for dedicating your time on a thrilling project - Bitcoin.
Recently, this idea came into my mind. I tried to summarize and write it down as clear as possible, following BIP3, which states: "As a first sketch of the proposal is taking shape, the authors should present it to the Bitcoin Development Mailing List. This gives the authors a chance to collect initial feedback and address fundamental concerns." I refrained from forking the github bitcoin/bips tree just to upload one properly formatted document. I am no programmer and unfamiliar to the world of bitcoin developers, so forgive me if I do things which seem strange to you.
The main question about this idea is: does a suitable function exists? I thought of discrete exponentiation. But as a former math student, I remember that this does not always work as expected beforehand... All I know that a similar concept is used in Diffie-Hellman Key Exchange and you're more into cryptography as I am. Therefore I thought that it's best to ask this question to you. Maybe you have a better idea.
If no idea comes up, well... then it's a dead end.
Best Dr. Oso Phila, a small bug
Have you read BIP39 in detail?
It sounds like you're inventing an alternative to the passphrase protection described here: https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039.mediawiki#from-mnemonic-to-seed
On Sat, Mar 28, 2026 at 2:54 PM dr.oso.phila.cgeyb via Bitcoin Development Mailing List <bitcoindev@googlegroups•com> wrote:
Quoted text (36 lines)
> Dear Developers > > Thank you for dedicating your time on a thrilling project - Bitcoin. > > Recently, this idea came into my mind. I tried to summarize and write it > down as clear as possible, following BIP3, which states: > "As a first sketch of the proposal is taking shape, the authors should > present it to the Bitcoin Development Mailing List. This gives the > authors a chance to collect initial feedback and address fundamental > concerns." > I refrained from forking the github bitcoin/bips tree just to upload one > properly formatted document. I am no programmer and unfamiliar to the > world of bitcoin developers, so forgive me if I do things which seem > strange to you. > > The main question about this idea is: does a suitable function exists? I > thought of discrete exponentiation. But as a former math student, I > remember that this does not always work as expected beforehand... > All I know that a similar concept is used in Diffie-Hellman Key Exchange > and you're more into cryptography as I am. Therefore I thought that it's > best to ask this question to you. Maybe you have a better idea. > > If no idea comes up, well... then it's a dead end. > > Best > Dr. Oso Phila, a small bug > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Bitcoin Development Mailing List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bitcoindev+unsubscribe@googlegroups•com. > To view this discussion visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/bitcoindev/177470526996.8.13158104493925689779.1256635257%40aleeas.com > . >